Epic vs apple & google

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#1
Epic is doing what a lot of companies are unwilling to do, they stand up to both apple and google despite severe retaliation. It's very clear we should all be supporting Epic in this fight.

theverge.com/2020/8/13/21368395/fortnite-epic-games-oneplus-deal-google-play-store-lawsuit-lg

Closed platforms like the ios ecosystem are not good for anyone other than the companies that provide these platforms. Apple being forced to open up their app-store would be a good thing but unfortunately that is probably not going to happen.


The less closed platforms people have to deal with the better, epic is of course focusing on smartphones while ignoring the issue of consoles being heavily restricted but we cannot expect them to go to war against 5 companies at once.

https://www.macrumors.com/2020/08/24/apple-epic-court-battle-august-28-removal/

Currently epic has been granted a restraining order in the case of the unreal engine (apple retaliated by trying to take away epics access to development tools) but they didn't side with epic in the case of fortnite, the final vertict is likely to also be this.
 

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#2
7 Myths Apple Is Using to Justify Their 30% Tax on Apps
Apple spends a lot of money on PR and lobbying in order to keep their monopoly power. If you follow the debate around Apple’s 30% cut that results in higher prices and worse apps, you are guaranteed to encounter at least one of the false narratives disclosed below.

Myth 1. 30% commission allows Apple to maintain the App Store.
In fact, running an app store costs only a fraction of what Apple takes from app developers. Every quarter, Apple receives billions of dollars from third-party apps. Meanwhile, the expenses required to host and review these apps are in the tens of millions, not billions of dollars. We know that because we at Telegram host and review more public content than the App Store ever will. Actually, any company running a massive video platform will need both more servers and more moderators than a company running an app store.

Myth 2. 30% commission allows Apple to reinvest in building better iPhones.
In reality, Apple has around $200 billion in cash on hand – and has no idea what to do with it. The money that Apple takes away from startups that need it for growth is parked seemingly forever in Apple’s offshore accounts. For the last few years, Apple has been trying to catch up with Android phones in features and hardware. Since Cupertino no longer innovates, and copying stuff doesn’t require a large R&D budget, the $200 billion (which includes the funds taken from developers) is not used on improving iPhones.

Myth 3. Anyone can compete with Apple if they don’t like their 30% commission.
The problem is not to create a rival mobile Operating System (OS), but to get third-party developers build apps for this new OS. There’s a vicious circle: devs don’t build apps if the OS doesn’t have enough users, and users don’t buy phones if there aren’t enough third-party apps for them. Even Microsoft, with its huge influence among developers, failed to have apps (such as Instagram) built for their Windows Phone, and Microsoft had to shut down their OS. So no matter how much you invest in building an alternative, the 2020 mobile OS market is closed to new entrants.

Myth 4. Without the iPhone, mobile app developers wouldn’t have a way to distribute their apps.
Not only is this false, but the reverse is true: without third-party apps, few people would buy an iPhone in 2020. Apple didn’t invent native mobile apps, and if it hadn’t been for Apple, another company would have filled the demand for a touch-based mobile OS, maybe a few years later. Before the world switched from desktop to mobile, app developers already had hundreds of millions of users and paid zero commission to desktop OS creators. For developers of consumer services, the arrival of the App Store was a change for the worse.

Myth 5. Any developer who doesn’t like the 30% commission on iPhones can just build apps for Android.
Developers don’t really have a choice between iOS and Android: if they want to create a service that is socially relevant, they will have to build apps for both platforms in the mobile duopoly. Try to imagine Telegram or TikTok as Android-only apps and you will quickly understand why avoiding Apple is impossible. You can’t just exclude iPhone users. As for the iPhone users, the costs for consumers to switch from an iPhone to an Android is so high that it qualifies as a monopolistic lock-in (more about this in The Antitrust Case Against Apple, a study done by Yale University).

Myth 6. App Store’s 30% commission is in line with what other platforms are charging.
Apple just published a study that says that other platforms such as Android’s Google Play also have a 30% commission. This comparison is irrelevant, because Android allows its users to install apps from sources other than Google Play. One can even run competing app stores on Android. As for the other platforms mentioned in the market overview, they have nothing to do with mobile operating systems and are nowhere near iOS and Android in terms of the number of users / number of third-party apps / switching costs for consumers.

Myth 7. Having regulators look at Apple’s practices goes against the free market and fair competition.
As seen in Myth 3, there’s no real competition in the mobile OS market, but Apple is also not a “free market” player, because it extensively uses the power of regulators to criminalise jailbreaks and ensure complete control over every phone they sell. Since Apple’s monopoly is enforced by the regulators in the first place, it is difficult to justify a libertarian approach to their practices. As long as governments help Apple retain their monopoly, they are also responsible for dealing with the negative side effects of it.

Now that anti-monopoly investigations against Apple have started in the EU and the US, I expect Apple to double down on spreading such myths as described above. We shouldn’t sit idly and let Apple’s lobbyists and PR agents do their thing. At the end of the day, it is up to us – consumers and creators – to defend our rights and to stop monopolists from stealing our money. They may think they have tricked us into a deadlock, because we’ve already bought a critical mass of their devices and created a critical mass of apps for them. But we shouldn’t be giving them a free ride any longer.

https://telegra.ph/7-Myths-Apple-Is-Using-to-Justify-Their-30-Tax-on-Apps-07-27

Apple has a long history of anti-consumer practices such as trying to prevent people from repairing their own phones which would in a lot of cases result in people losing data that is very important to them, it's not just about the cost of having to buy a new phone.
 

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#3
What about game consoles?
The situation of game consoles is different for several reasons
1. Console manufacturers typically lose money on the hardware and thus they need to lock down their platform to make that money back, if their platform was open they would have to charge more for each console sold.
2. Unlike smartphones you can very easily live your life without owning a consoles, they are kinda like luxery items (especially upcoming consoles).
3. the dominant gaming platform is windows 10 which is a relatively open platform, far better than android.

Of course console gaming still sucks, PC (windows 10) is clearly a far superior platform https://vintologi.com/threads/ps5-vs-pc-vs-xbox-sx.704/#post-3762

What sony is doing with exclusives is clearly anti-consumer and borderline illegal, they rely on exclusive games to coerce people into buying bad hardware and get locked to a closed platform.

https://vintologi.com/threads/playstation-4-sucks.714/

Sony has however released some of their previous exclusives to PC, it's mostly nintendo that refuse to release their games on any other platform but you can still play these games using emulators.

A compromise solution would be forcing console manufacturers to allow the install of another operating system similar to what sony did for the original ps3 (while still taking a big loss on each console sold).
 

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#4
Can epic win against google?
You can download apps outside the playstore but then you will get multiple security warnings.

Google has a near monopoly when it comes to smartphone operating systems (far bigger than apple) so they might not get away with nearly as much as apple can get away with.
 

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#5
Antitrust laws explained
It's legal to be big as long as you do not abuse your dominant market position,


 

Creamer

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#6
I really dont see the problem in openning an app store, you can sell APK which are the app files like you sell digital books.I guess the main issue would be advertisement
 

Admin

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#7
I really dont see the problem in openning an app store, you can sell APK which are the app files like you sell digital books.I guess the main issue would be advertisement
One issue epic has mentioned is multiple security warnings if you install an app outside the play store.

On IOS you need to jailbreak your phone first.
 
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